I Kissed A Boy & Girl Stars on Cancellation, Toxic Gays & Open Relationships

00:00:00: Hi, shout out to you if your watching us for the first time.

00:00:03: We're now on YouTube Apple Podcasts and Spotify Got Gareth Valentino named Spaulding from I Kissed a Boy And I Kissed A Girl.

00:00:09: They are here with me today.

00:00:11: It's very exciting.

00:00:12: they've got a new podcast that have Josh Cavallo Australian footballer as their first guest.

00:00:18: then he has an exclusive.

00:00:19: they refuse.

00:00:20: give me the exclusive.

00:00:21: i can't say I blame them but yeah we talk about him.

00:00:25: bit of what was saying in this show.

00:00:27: uh queer footballers that are approaching him secretly.

00:00:32: Queer politics,

00:00:33: sex

00:00:34: and culture outcast world!

00:00:36: Right.

00:00:36: so um brief history for you.

00:00:38: in twenty-twenty three the BBC made history with iKisterboy the UK's first ever gay dating show And then a year later they did it again With iKistigirl The First Ever Dating Show on British television Made exclusively For Queer Women.

00:00:52: Both shows were filmed In Italy both hosted by the Queen Queen Danny, Danny Monogh.

00:00:59: both became genuinely important cultural moments.

00:01:02: then in March this year the BBC cancelled them.

00:01:05: Oh

00:01:06: can we have a reaction?

00:01:07: and it noises to that?

00:01:09: Boo!

00:01:10: Boo!

00:01:10: To canceling queer shows.

00:01:12: Funding challenges they said.

00:01:14: what do you think of fun funding challenges?

00:01:19: Good to good noise.

00:01:20: It was a good news out of the ashes or that two are fan favorites from those shows have launched their own podcast.

00:01:25: it's called its started with a kiss sits back by tinder And it launched,

00:01:30: well

00:01:31: we're recording this days before launch aren't we?

00:01:34: One of them is Gareth Valentino an Irish stylist and fashion editor based in East London who was on series one of I Kiss the Boy.

00:01:40: The other is Amy Spaulding.

00:01:41: you appeared on Series One Of I Kissed.

00:01:43: a Girl runs her own jewellery brandon whom the internet decided pretty quickly with the people's lesbian princess.

00:01:49: Gareth!

00:01:49: Amy welcome to our cast world.

00:01:51: how are ya?

00:01:52: Oh

00:01:53: my gosh, what

00:01:55: intros?

00:01:56: Wow!

00:01:56: I had to big you up.

00:01:57: Where

00:01:57: are

00:01:57: ya?!

00:01:58: I'm trying to work out where you are... ...I want people who can see-.

00:02:01: Where

00:02:01: am i at sir?

00:02:01: My

00:02:02: boudoir!

00:02:03: Where are you sorry?

00:02:04: We're in my Boudoir.

00:02:05: Oh and your boudoire okay What?

00:02:07: erm?

00:02:08: Yeah Erm.. I don't wanna ask what normally Goes down on the boudware.

00:02:14: I wanna know.

00:02:15: Well

00:02:16: there's nothing going with lesbian everything being this way.

00:02:18: No no only good things Only hold some thing.

00:02:22: and gossiping.

00:02:23: And gossiping, obviously they are important things.

00:02:26: so you've both been on BBC shows that literally didn't exist before you were on them first thing's first how big did it actually feel from the inside because out here in the rest of world look pretty enormous not going to lie?

00:02:44: It was crazy.

00:02:46: I was actually the first one into like be filmed in there.

00:02:52: Yeah, it was crazy.

00:02:53: so I mean they because we were like COVID times.

00:02:56: So Like iIwas blindfolded driven up to the place We were putting in ten Sam!

00:03:00: The nerves Were like Crazy.

00:03:01: also I Was very aware that the rest of my hometown and the rest Of Ireland were going To get the confirmation That I am In fact a gay man

00:03:09: On TV.

00:03:10: And how was that?

00:03:11: Was that

00:03:11: A lot of fear then?

00:03:12: It's quite... yeah..it was like a Lot of Fear but it was Also like I kind of felt in My heart in my mind that it was time and I needed to do because i wasn't gonna like, not just not be gauged.

00:03:24: you know what I mean?

00:03:25: Yeah.

00:03:25: Like I moved to London then I was right.

00:03:27: okay That's why I've moved here To get away from all And really kind of come into my own.

00:03:31: So It is a very scary experience but...it was exciting as well

00:03:36: Albert Amy how was it for you?

00:03:39: I think yeah.

00:03:40: Very similarly When we were out filming it..like I remember Like I got two lesbian sisters at home And I know that growing up, we very much didn't have any representation.

00:03:52: Like...I remember seeing Love Island one year and like there being this plot where these two girls kissed and I ran home all of the sixty-f loads up to it.

00:04:06: just get a tiny dog drog with a W or W plot line.

00:04:10: so when was an opportunity to go on something solely about us, we were the main event.

00:04:16: I was kind of like i'm doing this for me my younger self and my younger sisters absolutely.

00:04:20: And then when we're out there like if the crew is just so incredibly queer as well and I remember having conversation with Shaw who's actually a really good friend of ours.

00:04:28: Love you, Shaw!

00:04:30: She was basically saying she was just like... This show no matter what I do in rest of life will always be one of probably the most proud thing ever done.

00:04:38: yeah..and I felt that but don't think it was until the show aired, but like it really kind of became apparent that yeah I mean especially with the reaction to The Girls one from a sapphic sense.

00:04:52: It felt really...

00:04:54: Is groundbreaking wasn't it?

00:04:55: Yeah!

00:04:57: Felt groundbreaking which

00:04:58: just

00:04:59: you know is..I can die like...

00:05:04: Don't

00:05:04: die?!

00:05:04: I said

00:05:04: don't die!

00:05:05: Don't Die!

00:05:07: Certainly not now!

00:05:08: We wouldn't make

00:05:14: a clip

00:05:18: about this.

00:05:20: honestly.

00:05:22: Imagine that missa

00:05:25: I know what your funeral is going to be like.

00:05:27: There's gonna be Blacklist everywhere, White Chillips... The people will be wearing hats and gloves.

00:05:39: Oh, it'll be a hats-and-gloves style thing.

00:05:41: I've

00:05:41: wrongly styled by Garrett!

00:05:42: Okay all right.

00:05:43: Yeah

00:05:43: absolutely.

00:05:44: Gareth what about you?

00:05:45: What would your funeral be like?

00:05:46: You got no plans to pop off anytime soon.

00:05:48: so just theoretically right now

00:05:51: No My funeral oh my god It'd feel like something Kubrick quite clinical.

00:05:57: Yeah yeah yeah.

00:05:59: My

00:05:59: mark is psyched and I'm psyched too.

00:06:01: There's been lots of steel and whiteness.

00:06:04: Nice

00:06:06: It'd be like we're passing too.

00:06:07: Yeah, like we are in the hospital.

00:06:08: Would it

00:06:09: have been kind of

00:06:11: a bit post-industrial in vibes maybe?

00:06:14: Absolutely!

00:06:15: Like people will be on record wins and stuff.

00:06:17: that's going to be gorgeous.

00:06:18: I love a post

00:06:18: industrial funeral.

00:06:19: You coming next week?

00:06:20: What did

00:06:20: you know about... How

00:06:22: is your funeral?

00:06:23: What was that

00:06:24: sorry?!

00:06:26: Well, it's your funeral be like.

00:06:27: oh god my dark anyway

00:06:29: and people don't normally do this.

00:06:31: Mine I think you have

00:06:33: outcast on the side.

00:06:35: Oh

00:06:35: God yeah, I'd have to have a branded had ever branded funeral.

00:06:38: I want everyone in tears Everyone?

00:06:40: I want every one pre tiered at my funeral.

00:06:43: if you're not crying then You're not going to heaven when you die.

00:06:46: There's jobs

00:06:46: on your seat.

00:06:48: Yeah, please.

00:06:49: Yeah, I just won everyone Just in bits of my funeral.

00:06:53: Please just remember that.

00:06:57: What did the edit of The Show Get Right about you and what did it get completely, terribly wrong for both of you actually?

00:07:04: I hate to ask when we've got two people.

00:07:06: Amy go first on that.

00:07:09: To be fair... ...I

00:07:11: think with The Edit Got Right is how clearly ADHD was Like i was running around looking for things to do, just like fun to have where there wasn't any.

00:07:24: No, well there was loads of fun obviously but as in like on days that we'd just be sitting around the pool I would be like plotting what to do.

00:07:30: Yeah let's go.

00:07:31: To tease girls weird or have fun with... But why did they get wrong?

00:07:38: I don't know!

00:07:39: To be honest it felt pretty authentic and people said oh its nice to see you're exactly the same.

00:07:46: yeah.

00:07:49: So, do

00:07:52: you think they got it right then?

00:07:53: Because some people... Some people leave these shows and are like that wasn't me.

00:07:55: That was not fair

00:07:57: No!

00:07:58: And I know i'm speaking from quite maybe a unique experience but.. But my experience where say is very authentic.

00:08:06: to give me no thats the same answer as for other girls.

00:08:10: They would be like oh I feel like my jokes were left out or something like that.

00:08:15: You left

00:08:15: all of your jokes out.

00:08:16: Oh my God How could we

00:08:18: do this?

00:08:20: That would be like my most heartbreaking thing.

00:08:22: My one-liners, my zingers!

00:08:25: But yeah no I think for my experience...I know that isn't the same experience with some of the girls so.. Yeah

00:08:31: You and yourself?

00:08:32: This

00:08:32: is myself.

00:08:32: It's hard not to me when you're saying ADHD can't stop yourself from... It just

00:08:35: flies out doesn't it?

00:08:36: It really does.

00:08:37: Everywhere.

00:08:38: Gareth, what about

00:08:38: you?

00:08:39: How

00:08:39: was it?

00:08:41: I think people think From whatever I gathered whenever it was aired or stuff People were saying how wise I was And i'm a bit wise.

00:08:51: Yeah, they were like oh he's like the mother and father of Demas Ria giving people wisdom.

00:08:57: I didn't think i was that wise at all very long.

00:09:00: Oh no we'll

00:09:01: stick with whys!

00:09:01: I don't know...I think it got me pretty spot on And maybe a bit more military in my day-to-day life That's true.

00:09:17: It made come across as well Like in real life.

00:09:20: I'm at six.

00:09:22: Need to do this, need to do there's yes for us.

00:09:23: so i think you're really motivated as a holdage not maybe like you

00:09:26: really motivate.

00:09:27: you go the gym in the morning and all stuff like that before work.

00:09:31: yeah i got about five or six and i'd go to the gym for seven.

00:09:34: um there till eight nine and then i do my bits start working.

00:09:39: Yeah,

00:09:39: yeah and by the time ten a.m rolls around I'm with you.

00:09:41: Honestly these people get

00:09:42: in the gym at six o'clock in the morning.

00:09:47: Oh my

00:09:48: god!

00:09:48: I die honestly.

00:09:49: I just don't know how it does that.

00:09:50: Love

00:09:51: it.

00:09:51: Honestly if i work up what six?

00:09:53: Well

00:09:53: im like a vampire.

00:09:54: its not me i just like eyes.

00:09:56: Im not tired when ill wake-up I just go out to bed early as well.

00:09:58: are ya one of them?

00:09:59: You can sleep in your day or with my dad.

00:10:00: be safe.

00:10:01: Mmmmm like ten eleven?

00:10:03: That

00:10:03: is early.

00:10:03: Is

00:10:03: it?!

00:10:04: Is

00:10:04: that early?

00:10:05: Yeah, it's

00:10:05: quite early.

00:10:07: But well done to you for getting up earlier and all of that!

00:10:10: What is the most uncomfortable attention... ...you've had both of these since this show went out.

00:10:18: You got good story.

00:10:23: That was weird.

00:10:25: Well I actually was on a date with this guy.

00:10:29: We went in a few dates then obviously after a few days we stayed home or whatever did whatever and then he went to do something in the bathroom, I just leave after his phone there on it lit up.

00:10:39: And i was like have you got a picture of him naked yet show me?

00:10:42: In a grid chat.

00:10:43: Oh no!

00:10:45: Who is doing that

00:10:46: with?!

00:10:46: It wasn't...

00:10:47: The press!

00:10:49: Well..I didn't say- No if....it's just like a bunch of evil guys who want to see me naked for some reason.

00:10:55: so Well, I just pretend that I didn't see a thing and then it's kind of like yeah.

00:11:00: It was okay.

00:11:01: See layer them blocked him.

00:11:02: Yeah

00:11:05: autonomy?

00:11:06: Yeah but gay men are horrible.

00:11:07: we know

00:11:08: this But why all right where gay man can be horrible to each other There's.

00:11:12: no there's not worse enemy for gay men than gay men i think.

00:11:15: Why our right yr gay men?

00:11:18: And when always orable what way are we so horrible through each other?

00:11:21: now you Can Just imagine the whatsapp group.

00:11:22: don't get picture on quick So We can bitch it.

00:11:25: yeah

00:11:27: We talk about

00:11:28: this a lot.

00:11:28: Amy witnessed it, remember?

00:11:30: Because you didn't believe me I was like gay men hate me for some reason and we were at Barcelona And we're just like mingling outside.

00:11:37: I went over to the bar to have a drink.

00:11:38: then i was smiling.

00:11:39: these other guys that are there.

00:11:40: They gave us their dirtiest look and walked away and said, Amy did you see them?

00:11:44: Yeah It's such different experience.

00:11:46: in Lesbian girls We lived eachother up and we rallied through each others so much.

00:11:51: I'm

00:11:52: just telling Lesbians, we need to take a note of lesbians but because they rally for everyone like look at what their doing with the cancellation of this show.

00:11:59: Like you guys are almost protesting for it.

00:12:02: Game and don't care!

00:12:03: They want to be top gay.

00:12:04: Yeah... I will talk myself like gay men is only one space on the top whereas lesbianes there's loads of spaces where all going together.

00:12:14: Well whats

00:12:14: that thing i see about on that subject?

00:12:17: And i think theres cross over here really right wing gay man.

00:12:21: Do you know what I mean?

00:12:23: It's come from nowhere, like on GB News and stuff like that.

00:12:26: And what was it...

00:12:26: What?!

00:12:27: Why wouldn't it actually just talking about something else?

00:12:30: Yeah the two words not.

00:12:31: well Not Well!

00:12:33: Where

00:12:33: does it comes from though?

00:12:35: Think abouder

00:12:36: Don't really have that.

00:12:37: in a lesbian community at all

00:12:39: There is no right when lesbians are there or i can think of any.

00:12:41: Can you think of anything?

00:12:43: I could think of transphobic lesbianes

00:12:45: but not really right-wing.

00:12:49: We're like, exclusionary but in the left wing we can't hang it up.

00:12:52: But at least for a left-wing... ...we never dabble over.

00:12:58: that I know of.

00:12:59: Actually do you know one?

00:13:00: I used to work with a right-wing lesbian and her dog's called Donald Trump.

00:13:08: The dog was called Donald and two dogs called Donald &

00:13:11: Trump!

00:13:13: No, no.

00:13:13: It's just one and so on but named after Donald Trump She is like a lesbian But super right-wing Super like A major landlord.

00:13:22: Just the people that have been endoppened into head renormative.

00:13:26: I don't know what it is This weird.

00:13:29: If you are gay or lesbian And you're right wing Please i beg of You to do research and maybe just

00:13:36: Open

00:13:38: your

00:13:40: book!

00:13:42: And also take a look around you because everyone who answers in your right-wing corner hates your guts and doesn't want you to exist.

00:13:48: They

00:13:48: all wanna say like, oh well we've had enough rights given to us that I don't want any more.

00:13:53: if i wanted them taken away then why would u fucking tell?

00:13:57: Look at Peter

00:13:57: Till!

00:13:58: What is he getting from being abasted other than rich?

00:14:05: Well thats exactly it.

00:14:08: You said the buzzword there.

00:14:12: It was like, I'm the guy who doesn't bring that pride.

00:14:16: shit around me.

00:14:17: He's just a man.

00:14:18: he likes men and it's like babe.

00:14:20: you would be stoned to death if it wasn't for Pride.

00:14:23: Also

00:14:23: everyone knows If Arianna Grande is in Rome You'll be spinning her eyes today.

00:14:27: Yeah!

00:14:27: You don't need to be masculine or feminine but... Internally homophobic.

00:14:34: It's

00:14:34: yeah, it's that is internal and internalism phobia And they need therapy.

00:14:37: so

00:14:37: when we've all I feel like i've been through it but internalizmophobia or i'm forty two right.

00:14:42: So in my past?

00:14:43: Yeah have being liked.

00:14:44: there's been periods where i'd be like no No, just think gays are a pain-in the arse.

00:14:48: Well maybe

00:14:48: We were being internally homophobic When we said that with gay men horrible its complex isn't it?

00:14:53: why Are we just such a mess?

00:14:54: and thats whole new episode.

00:14:58: Yeah,

00:15:03: we've seen things in our lives that have made us seem a kind of way of thinking.

00:15:08: But

00:15:08: the thing is men are still men aren't they?

00:15:10: I always think it's quite apparent.

00:15:11: Men are still... It's still man you know!

00:15:13: That's what.... I kinda had this revolution the other day where i was like oh my god gay men are men.

00:15:19: Yeah yeah uh..I don't know if

00:15:22: I'm texting a bit.

00:15:22: I know

00:15:23: but its

00:15:23: still...its still kind of like-

00:15:26: Let's say I'm lesbian by proxy then.

00:15:27: Yeah,

00:15:28: I think you are.

00:15:29: By osmosis or something that i didn't listen to enough in

00:15:32: school.

00:15:35: Also thats a big side A bad gay.

00:15:38: if you don't have any lesbian friends You're a bad guy True!

00:15:40: Or all your friends are white?

00:15:41: I always like that.

00:15:42: You've got one person of colour as friend Interesting.

00:15:47: If your real friends are toxic gay males

00:15:50: then... Red flag, big red flag.

00:15:53: We were going through in the office a couple of things to ask you guys.

00:15:56: here's one monogamy versus open relationships.

00:15:59: they're both kind-of like what are your both sitting right now?

00:16:04: Yeah

00:16:05: but go

00:16:05: on.

00:16:06: I think we should take one at

00:16:11: a time and break it down.

00:16:15: To

00:16:17: be honest yeah,

00:16:18: like when I'm dating.

00:16:18: I'm daying and I'm like dating around And I'm taking water for people but as soon it's like I mean love.

00:16:22: like

00:16:23: lesbian

00:16:24: though I can't I try to touch it let me know.

00:16:27: Yeah What do you think that would change over the course of like years?

00:16:30: I

00:16:30: think he could be a conversation that had when we're like So deep into our relationship

00:16:35: if I don't have all of this sex

00:16:36: We know about its other Exactly, and by thinking will be exploring with each other Like not separate.

00:16:46: Right, okay Yeah that's fair enough.

00:16:48: yeah I

00:16:49: couldn't imagine like my god going on.

00:16:50: Gareth?

00:16:52: You've gone really quiet!

00:16:56: I'm in a monogamous relationship and we're at the start of the relationship but We had talks years down the line.

00:17:05: Yeah well were kind of very... I'm quite up front about feelings And so was he.

00:17:12: you know, we're very aware that open relationships are a big thing but not anytime soon and like it's going to be a big discussion.

00:17:19: Like... We're quite honest from the get go with each other?

00:17:22: Yeah I think it was definitely known as being more prevalent in gay male circles than lesbian male circles so..

00:17:28: But i am currently on monogamous relationship And Im Very Happy.

00:17:31: Are You Open To The Open?

00:17:33: If he wanted to talk about this I'd be like yeah

00:17:36: of course.

00:17:36: So who would- you sound really keen?

00:17:40: just for now?

00:17:42: Keep that in a box.

00:17:42: Have you done it before

00:17:43: okay?

00:17:43: I'm just very No, oh well yeah

00:17:47: what Oh my god this.

00:17:49: i was actually in

00:17:51: Non-consensual

00:17:52: non consensual Non monogamous relationship.

00:17:55: So the one who is monogamist and knew other person was just doing what they want.

00:17:59: Yeah, that's abusive.

00:18:00: basically find out about mine Mm.

00:18:03: Yeah make my ex.

00:18:05: Actually, I went home to visit someone at my family an Ireland and some Friends of mine or friends said me pictures were like, oh my God Garth throughout this party.

00:18:14: There's men everywhere and drugs blah-blah.

00:18:17: I was like sending pictures.

00:18:18: that's crazy.

00:18:19: And lo and behold it was my exes flat.

00:18:22: So he was having The most been about thirty man.

00:18:27: so you went away?

00:18:28: He just led a massive chem sex sort of blowout kind of thing yeah.

00:18:36: And then I confronted him and he was like, oh you deserve a variable man.

00:18:41: Of course i was that deep into the relationship... ...I accepted them and tried open relationships.. Then he got jealous because guys wanted to be with me not him!

00:18:50: Basically I just stopped speaking to him anyway.... ...I've got texts years ago saying hey we had an organic break up... Anyway moving to Paris with my new boyfriend.

00:18:59: It's like insane.

00:19:02: And also I find out from other people that he was HIV positive, but you never told me the whole time and i wasn't really protected myself.

00:19:09: Which is fine to be HIV-positive!

00:19:11: But yeah

00:19:13: oh god where do we begin with?

00:19:14: So...I

00:19:15: will say my experience with non monogamy hasn't been great.

00:19:20: Wow

00:19:21: there's so much fun coming

00:19:23: down.

00:19:23: What are like..so

00:19:24: what....I think that they're a feel of it.

00:19:27: sorry for Like your ex has obviously got a problem, hasn't he?

00:19:30: And is processing trauma around HIV and stuff.

00:19:32: It's very hard to disclose but you know it's not... Yeah of course!

00:19:37: You know we know that things are easier for us.

00:19:40: Sounds like even through really bad time though I'm really sorry to hear about

00:19:43: that.

00:19:43: But also if you love someone and were as close as they said was He should have been fine with sharing that with me because there would be an understanding You don't?

00:19:52: Yeah no

00:19:53: big time

00:19:55: Right,

00:19:56: whilst I've got yours you're on for two episodes.

00:19:58: don't know if you were told that.

00:20:01: So we are going to talk a bit more political in the next one but tell us quickly before we go about your podcast which first one was on this week.

00:20:10: really excited about it yeah?

00:20:14: Yeah i think we'll be watching another episode.

00:20:18: so it's Christine McGinnis and Josh Gravalo.

00:20:23: Just absolutely incredible, I guess.

00:20:25: Like what a way to launch the Polkarnage!

00:20:28: I mean Christy is honesty...

00:20:30: It's finished with Christine and we went into her.

00:20:33: she just remember when i just went to Amy was like I love her.

00:20:36: She's amazing, so honest yeah And just fun So

00:20:40: fun and so honest and so raw and like..I think alot of people A lot of queer women who have maybe lived their life in you know us.

00:20:50: We all do it in a compact world and are now kind of figuring out that actually like, That isn't the only option.

00:20:58: And maybe there's a queerness in themselves.

00:21:01: they'll be able to look at her story and you know find it so inspiring.

00:21:05: She said that she was like oh I think people think because i'm a woman and have been married and had kids but can start this queer journey But shes

00:21:13: always been on!

00:21:15: So shes living proof for that on the podcast view as a woman, maybe in her position.

00:21:22: Yeah exactly!

00:21:22: And what about Joshua Cavallo?

00:21:24: That's an incredible story.

00:21:25: like football is obviously beautiful as well.

00:21:28: Football is rife with homophobia it's ridiculous but obviously packed to the rafters with secret gays don't you?

00:21:35: How was

00:21:35: that?

00:21:36: Well that's why he was telling us... He was telling me about yeah look The Secret Gays that you know may be message him.

00:21:42: I mean You have to listen to this episode But

00:21:44: we're not giving

00:21:45: too much away though right now talks about and his journey as like the first openly gay footballer, which is just insane that it was twenty-twenty one when that happened.

00:21:55: Like what?

00:21:56: I find him so inspiring to come out so publicly in a head through an orbit of space like... That must have taken balls!

00:22:04: And i found him as a person who's just so past people.

00:22:06: Adorable!

00:22:08: It's hope he was there with us!

00:22:11: The other boys!

00:22:12: I loved them

00:22:12: both!

00:22:15: Love them both.

00:22:16: But no, yeah It's going to be an incredible podcast with Incredible stories and incredible experiences And it's a laugh like its hilarious and funny in chaotic and all great things that you know being queer is Wrapped up into one neat little podcast.

00:22:30: Yep

00:22:31: What was I called?

00:22:32: gonna forgot what they?

00:22:33: um?

00:22:34: It started with a kiss.

00:22:37: We're gonna talk more about it next time and I need to have a lot of chat too as well on our next episode, some things going in the world.

00:22:44: More about that next.

00:22:46: This is Outcast

00:22:50: World.